2nd & 9th String Tuning on Right Lever Right

[RichS]

Hi all

A question from a newbie if someone could kindly help please!

I’m having trouble with tuning my 2nd and 9th strings on a GFI, Expo with 3 pedals and 4 levers.

I get the open 2nd and 9th stings in tune, no problem. Then I get the whole stop lower on both strings (using the nylon nuts) at C# (right lever right) no problem.

But when I use right lever right on string 2 on a half stop to bring me to a D note, it’s sharp by about 10 cents. Clearly to adjust this to its correct pitch will alter the C#!

Thanks in advance!

[Zebedee]

Are there 2 nylon tuners on the 9th string, 1 raise and 1 lower, both activated by the RKR ?

If so, the half tone drop on the second string is set by the lowering nylon on the ninth string just starting to activate the ninth finger when the second string has dropped a semitone.

Carry on moving the RKR until it reaches its stop, by which time the second string will have dropped a tone, and the ninth string will have lowered too much.

Bring the ninth string back up to C# using the upper nylon tuner.

[RichS]

Hi Rich

Thanks very much for the reply. The ninth string has only one nut to it.

[Zumbilly(Murdoch)]

Hi Rich,
I am not conversant with Your guitar but on My Rittenberry the second string feel stop is set with the ninth string plastic nut as described previously.'
Have a look above the endplate,there may be a hex headed screw which is a final stop for the ninth string if you fully engage the knee lever.adjusting this screw it will give the desired stop to get the correct pitch.You will be able to see the screw by looking down from the top of the guitar just behind the changer where the strings are attatched.

[Haddock]

Hi Rich
Looks like you have a raise on string 2 as well. Check to see what lever or pedal pulls that. If its the RKR then that’s the one to pull your flat string back to pitch after setting the split. If not, then you need a new rod and entry into the world of tweaking.
Cheers
Calum

[bob adams]

RKR it is Calum!! A light bulb moment perhaps!! Think about it!!

[RichS]

Thanks Billy, Bob and Calum!

The top nylon nut on string 2 tunes RKL from D# to E.

I did consider this but, in the words of Roy Walker, it’s not the one.

I’ll have a look above the end plate as Billy suggests and revert back.

Thanks again!

[RichS]

I’ve pulled this from the ‘FAQ’ section of the GFI website, and despite reading it several times, doesn’t make a huge amount of sense;

How do I tune the E9 2nd string half stop feel?

On GFI Pro models, the half stop feel for the E9 2nd string is accomplished by the RR knee lever beginning to pull the 9th string as the 2nd string reaches a half tone. The 2nd string full whole tone lower is tuned with the nylon nut, then the 9th string half tone lower is tuned also with the nylon nut. The resulting half stop feel for the 2nd string works out due to the choice of lowering spring tension, string gauges, and leverage ratios in the linkage. Altering the lowering spring tension for the 9th string can change the feel of the half stop but will also slightly affect the pitch of the half stop as well.

Does this make sense to anyone else?

[Haddock]

Hi Rich
I think they’re saying that what you have to do is find, by trial and error, the best crank positions for the 9 and 2 pulls that gives you the nearest to a perfect result. Start with the tone lower on 2, and then have 9 kicking in at the half way point so that you can feel the semitone drop on 2. Then if you go all the way down, if 9 is going too far then its rod needs moved to a crank position nearer the crossrod until you can hit all the notes more or less in tune. Another variable is the overall amount of travel on the knee lever, adjustable by its end stop. And you might need to experiment with the crank position for 2 as well. I had to do it this way on my old LDG and found it worked well but took a while to find the magic positions. And if you change string gauges, you have to start over. By far the nicest solution is an extra rod either on 9 or 2 giving you more control. Even then, getting the crank positions in the right ballpark to start with makes the half stop feel better. I’m spoilt now as my MSA has end stop ‘split screws’ that let you tune the lowest point of travel for each lower but I still have a good few split tuning rods elsewhere for tuning other combinations.
An afternoon should do it and you’ll be very happy when you find the sweet spot!
Cheers
Calum

[simon_f3]

Hi Rich (oops, just realised Calum answered this between my starting to reply and eventually posting!),
I had the same question not that long ago. My reading of that excerpt is that if you want to get the half-stop exactly right then you need to play around with the undercarriage by trial and error! My Sho-Bud has the same kind of set-up, and as soon as I get round to it (I am due to retire in only 26 years but hope to get this done within 15...) I am going to add another linkage to the raise finger of the 9th string. This will permit precise adjustment of the half stop on the 2nd string so that 2nd and 9th can both be tuned properly. May be worth a look here: https://www.thebritishsteeliessociety.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=39&t=10548
Good luck,
Sid