Nice chord sequence here

[Will C]

I've had this thing about the major second lately, as I woke up to just how often it crops up in songs all over the place, in every genre - but especially in country, it seems. By this I mean that, instead of going, say, from a C to a Dm, sometimes the song goes through a D major instead, on its way to a G (or G7) and then back to a C.

So, in terms of numbers, it goes I - II - V - I, rather than I - ii - V - I, as you might expect. So far so good, and trying to learn to play without mastering this trick seems to me like trying to learn to speak English, without ever using the letter "e" in any of your words.

But I just stumbled upon a nice variant of using the major 2nd, in one of the songs by Marley's Ghost, off "Jubilee". Thanks to Bob Adams for flagging this excellent band. There's a great song featuring Emmylou Harris called "Unwed Fathers" (eg at about 46-48s) where, instead of going I - II - V - I, the song goes from the I to the V through a quick sequence of three chords, they are V - II - V.

Here it is:



It really grabbed my ear, and I mithered on and on till I worked it out. Ok, that didn't take too long, but I would never have thought of doing it this way.

The chords are (in the key of G) D - A - D. Using strings 5&6, the first D is at 17 with the A & B pedals, you run down to 12 for the A, then to 13 with A & F, before going back to the G. The A is the "foreigner" - the accidental (a note out of key) is what grabs the ear.

It's tiny ideas like this that we grasp from listening to others that builds our own understanding.

[Danny Mitchell]

It dfinitly catchs th ar, Will. And what you'v pointd out is th kind of manouvr that is xcutd so prfctly on the pdal stl guitar.

It's bloody hard to write English without using the letter 'e',too!

Great band, I hadn't heard of them till Bob posted their song. Now I'm a fan.

Thanks for posting.

[Will C]

Thanks, Danny. In view of the lack of replies I begin to see why others have complained about apathy. It's pretty plain to see that this sort of post is of no interest to most members. I guess they know it all already. I think I'll just keep these things to myself in future.

[JohnDavisStringsHere]

Will that is not the case, tis not apathy.... its just when you start talking chord names and notes it goes over the top of some heads now if you explained it with a sound clip I think the post would attract a lot more attention............
I did play that you tube clip but guess i missed it

[Danny Mitchell]

Please don't be put off Will. Since I took up the psg I've been overwhelmed by the generosity and enthusiasm of the steel community.
Your posts always adhere to Lord Reith's principles; inform, educate and entertain. So, please keep 'em comin'.

[Basil Henriques]

Will, it's VERY relevant and the change is subtle. What the problem is (Partially is that you are referring to the double dominant (or secondary dominant) with the wrong name : A major 2nd is an interval. the TWO Seventh is a chord.) the nomenclature is not correct. BUT Your point is most valid. The fact that some can't hear the change is worrying though, after all, it's a very basic 'passing chord' in so many tunes. Don't worry though there are those who play Country Roads without the 7flat chord on the word "drivin' down the ROAD I get a feeling" etc..

How this chord is indicated in musical analysis: When we write the musical analysis for a secondary chord, we use a “slash” notation, looking rather like a fraction. The slash sign can be thought to represent the word “of.” For example, V/vi would be read as “five of six,” referring to the dominant chord of the triad on the sixth scale degree. V7/V would be read as “five-seven of five.”

Resolution of secondary chords: Secondary dominant chords are resolved in the same way as a dominant chord would in diatonic harmony. The secondary dominant resolves to its tonic, taking special care with the active tones: leading tones want to be resolved up to their tonic note, and sevenths, if present, should resolve down by step.

[JohnDavisStringsHere]

There you go Will see how your topic has sprung back to life Baz that Country Roads thing is that where it goes from G flat-m to G before the D chord ? I can hear that change ok but not sure if I have the chord names correct........ to explain, coming at it as a wanna be guitar player I have always thought to play a minor chord on my steel go two frets down and use B and C pedals so I am on the 12th. fret with them down then two frets down for the G then pedals off D ....is this where its at??

Thanks for the help J.

[Basil Henriques]

There you go Will see how your topic has sprung back to life Baz that Country Roads thing is that where it goes from G flat-m to G before the D chord ? I can hear that change ok but not sure if I have the chord names correct.........

Hi John, not being at all familiar with the E9th copedent I couldn't say: What I CAN say is that In the key of A it would be F#m G D on the words "drivin' down the ROAD I get a feeling" etc.. [ 6m ] [ 7b ] [ 4 ]

N.B. The key of A contains three sharps in its scale; C#, F# and G#, because of that fact the correct name would be F#m being as F# is one of the notes of the scale and is indicated in the key signature sign that follows the clef on the manuscript .

And Will, you need to address that major 2nd thing, it's an interval not a chord..as I said in my previous reply to this thread.

[JohnDavisStringsHere]

Thank you Baz, I think we are playing the same notes on that subtle little change the difference between a G flat M and an Fsharp minor is not discernible to the naked ear by those of us that can only play by sound.... I should have studied more...

[Will C]

And here I was trying to keep it simple enough that people wouldn't be frightened off. Basil, you have an unerring instinct for complicating it to the point where almost everyone's eyes will glaze over, and they run for the hills!

To address your points:

1. In relation to "Country Roads", yes, there should be F#m, G, D in that line. If you don't play the G it sounds completely wrong. Secondary dominant? Most of us don't even know what the dominant is. Pity, but there you are. I was trying to keep it simple, to keep it accessible.

2. Yes, of course "major second" is the name of an interval. Everyone *should* know that a C scale, in chords, goes C, Dm, Em, F, G, Am...etc - so how else, with short, simple English, am I going to make reference to the second being a major chord instead of a minor? All sensible suggestions welcome. I stand by my (theoretically wrong) way of describing it until something better comes along. By the way, Basil, that A chord is A major, not A7. I will stake my ears on it.

But my basic point stands. Many members have looked, only three have commented. So I'm back where I started. It's depressing. But at least it's three more than I usually get.