Your views on practise

[Zumbilly(Murdoch)]

Morning All.
I have been playing mainly the Scottish scene for many years with various bands.
I currently play with two bands,each are five piece.The Scottish scene is pretty desparate and has been for a few years,My "first" band usually have 12 to 15 gigs per year and I am always on the lookout for more opportunities to get out and play.
Last Year I met up with a few other guys who had/were on the scene and We formed up and have done some gigs to date.The lead singer already plays with a duo and gets a fair bit of work so our availability is somewhat curtailed. That does not worry Me since a few extra gigs are always better than none.Over the years I have played with many bands and I have only ever had about five serious band practise sessions when We were preparing for a festival or backing a visiting artiste.
The lead guitar player for the second band is the unofficial spokesman/leader, He is keen as mustard and had to be held back from booking ridiculous gigs in pubs for really silly money,He does not have much of a pedigree in Country music and does all the things a bedroom player does(overplaying,flash licks etc.,)We recently had words about practise,He has booked studio time for three sessions prior to an upcoming gig,the studio is a one hour drive from My home and when all expenses are taken into account 40% of the fee for the gig will have been spent on practise !! The galling thing is that We have already had(since last year)about nine sessions and three gigs doing the same set list.I have refused to do these sessions and told Him that practise should be done at home and that I had never had a problem on stage in any of the country clubs We play.I have played with many deps who are able to sit in at the drop of a hat and do the bizz. I am not big headed and I know My limitations but I am quite confident that I can sit in with any band.
I am probably just letting off steam since I am an underworked and frustrated old phart. Any views would be welcome.
Best regards
Billy

[Willie Gamble]

You ARE an underworked and frustrated old phart.

Asleep at the steel

[Zumbilly(Murdoch)]

Many thanks Mr G for agreeing with Me
You most certainly are a good judge of bad whiskey !!

[Ken Byng]

Billy - your band member is showing signs of insecurity and inexperience. As you get older you do your rehearsing in your mind. At least I do. For cover versions, unless the bandleader insists on everyone playing their parts as per the record, you should agree who plays where in the song and then do your own thing. You can't legislate for a busy guitarist who thinks they are being paid by the note, and if they don't respond to gentle persuasion they should be elbowed out.

[JeffM]

Sounds to me like a rehearsal or two might be the perfect solution to sorting out the guitar player's overplaying.

You could suggest taking fills on different parts of the song, splitting solos sorting out a few harmony parts etc. All things that are obvious to experienced players such as yourself but probably not to some of the other guys in the band.

I suppose it depends on if yoiu are mainly interested in being in the band to do some extra gigs and earn some extra money or if you want the band to be better and be a more fun experience.

I think practicing (learning individual parts at home ) and rehearsing (with the whole band ) are 2 different things - the first is essential and the second can be useful and sometimes even enjoyable!

You might find a couple of rehearsals will keep the band on track for a while before you need any more.

[Zumbilly(Murdoch)]

Jeff,
Thanks for Your reply,
Perhaps I laid it on a bit thick about the guitar player overplaying,He does have a little trouble laying off when the steel is playing but it is not the main issue. My main point is the need to practise at a studio.as I pointed out ,the scene in Scotland is very poor,it is really unusual for a band (not a solo or duo) to get a regular run of gigs,two gigs within a week could be considered a major tour.
The benefits from proper band practise sessions can be beneficial but the bands I have played with have never felt the need since We are all experienced enough to play a Country song together after listening and practising at home.Sessions tend to be a totally different atmosphere from a stage performance in that any sessions are totally informal and end up with jokes and stories and playing random songs which with the best intentions turns out to be a jam session.
When the band got together We had a few "Jam type "sessions which provided the nucleus for a proper set list.After another few sessions We felt good to go and secured our first gig.This gig was a door money job intended to let people see and hear us,It turned out to be a great success and was one of the best payers I have had in a long time.We have a set list of 37 songs,Another gig was arranged and We did another two practise sessions (same set list) a little while later We got another gig and this one needed another session(same set) We now have another gig in six weeks time and the guitar player thinks We need three more sessions (same set) before We appear on stage. I am sure that the guitar player just likes jamming.I mentioned His getting pub gigs for silly money,I made it clear from the start that I would not play pub gigs(for many reasons) He argued that We could do a mixed set of country,rock,blues and pop,to which I replied We are a Country band.We agreed that the rest of the band would do a pub gig without Me. It turned out to be a disaster,not because I wasn't there, It just did not go down at all.No more pub gigs.
During one of our conversations I asked the guitar player a hypothetical question...."If you received a call from a (known) band saying that their guitarist had taken ill Would You be able to dep (next night) Would You do the gig? Bearing in mind that their set list is basic Country songs. His anawer was I would ask if We could have a couple of sessions first.!!
When all is said and done I do enjoy playing "live" with them but am I being unreasonable for not wanting to rehearse our (same)set?
Billy

[slimbo]

Hi Billy, I do the odd picking at home just to keep my fingers working, but I can remember all the runs I play and the favorite parts to the well known songs, so like yourself I feel I can fit in straight away with most band's, on the overplaying thing, I have only ever had to do this once.
If the band or someone in the band is all over the song I take off my picks and put down my bar, the obvious remark is, "Why aren't you playing", and the obvious reply is,"There's no bloody room, you seem to have it all tied up" the affect is immediate, and now I have the attention of all the other guys, even if it's not related to them, and he who overplays shut's down there and then, so there is no need to point out anybody and make them feel awkward, they know who they are, and it work's.

[JeffM]

When all is said and done I do enjoy playing "live" with them but am I being unreasonable for not wanting to rehearse our (same)set?
Billy

In the situation you describe I'm 100% with you on this. Disciplined, productive rehearsal is one thing and "pre-gig jam session(s)" is another. If I'm going to jam my way through the set, I'm happy to do it at the gig.

I play in bands that rehearse and those that don't and both can be a lot of fun but those that do rehearse do it properly - at least if they want me to come along they do.

[Zumbilly(Murdoch)]

Great advice Slimbo.
I recall a similar story being told by the late Jeff Newman,Jeff had been in London(I think) and was visiting a Country venue,He was invited on stage and after three songs He had been sitting behind the steel listening to a very busy band,the singer asked Jeff why He wasn't playing and Jeff said "Oh I did'nt know You wanted Me to play"

[Paul Brennan]

Hey Slimbo, Jeff told me the same story. It was a very successful Irish band at the time in the Galtymore, London (no names but it was a large guy called Thomas). He said the band was unbelievably loud on stage with no apparent discipline. Jeff just sat there politely with his arms folded until they eventually noticed and asked him why he wasn't playing to which he replied, "well are you going to let me play"?

In my experience country songs tend to follow a familiar pattern. Intro followed by a fill-free first verse then whoever did the intro fills the second verse, intro again/break followed by a quieter version in which the piano fills, etc, etc. Experienced players know this and are automatically on the watch out for who is taking the fills for that particular section of the song. They know the way a good country band should sound. People not used to playing country seem to be unaware of this and feel the need to rehearse everything or just overplay (or they're just idiots ! ). Pop or rock music is not so formulaic and does need to be rehearsed unless you're doing 12-bar blues numbers all night.