Muddy tone from Fender Student PSG
Mon Jun 24, 2024 10:34 am
Hi All,
Apologies in advance for the long post, but I'm really hoping for some of your wisdom here regarding tone. I just can't get a pleasing tone out of my Fender pull-release pedal steel, and it's driving me crackers. It doesn't matter what I do, I can't get that kind of crisp, crystalline sound out of it and the natural sustain just isn't there either. I've seen a few videos on Youtube and other folks are getting theirs to sound just fine (It's not fair I tell you!!!)
I'm playing through a Crate GX212 transistor amp with a Fender Twin Reverb kind of voicing (clean channel with Reverb, Bass, Mid and Treble) and depending on how I set the amp up, my steel either sounds muddy, or muffled (like when you cup your hand over your ear) with this weird kind of quack noise on the treble strings, almost like a wah pedal.
Just for the comparison, I've tried my old 6-string PSG with a fairly low-powered Gibson P90 pickup: same muddy tone, so I don't think my pickup is too hot.
Likewise, I've tried a Fender Jazzmaster (pickups are a lot like the 70s Fender P/U) through my Crate and I get a much more crisp, clean tone. I've also tried various other amps including a Peavey Envoy 110, a Sessionette 75 (transistor Vox-a-like), a Line6 Spider 5 set up like a Twin Reverb. I've tried it with and without the volume pedal. I've tried slimmer and lighter tone bars, but it always sounds the same.
So, my question is is it my technique: for example too much/little bar pressure? Is it my strings (GHS standard roundwound)? Is it my tone bar (a fairly weighty 3/4" nickel-steel thing)? Is it the Fender PSG itself and I'm expecting it to do things it will never do and it's just tough luck? Is it the amp (considering that other people get a nice bright sound out of a Twin)? Something else I haven't considered...
If you can help that'd be great cos it's really starting to put me off playing.
All the best, Nico
Apologies in advance for the long post, but I'm really hoping for some of your wisdom here regarding tone. I just can't get a pleasing tone out of my Fender pull-release pedal steel, and it's driving me crackers. It doesn't matter what I do, I can't get that kind of crisp, crystalline sound out of it and the natural sustain just isn't there either. I've seen a few videos on Youtube and other folks are getting theirs to sound just fine (It's not fair I tell you!!!)
I'm playing through a Crate GX212 transistor amp with a Fender Twin Reverb kind of voicing (clean channel with Reverb, Bass, Mid and Treble) and depending on how I set the amp up, my steel either sounds muddy, or muffled (like when you cup your hand over your ear) with this weird kind of quack noise on the treble strings, almost like a wah pedal.
Just for the comparison, I've tried my old 6-string PSG with a fairly low-powered Gibson P90 pickup: same muddy tone, so I don't think my pickup is too hot.
Likewise, I've tried a Fender Jazzmaster (pickups are a lot like the 70s Fender P/U) through my Crate and I get a much more crisp, clean tone. I've also tried various other amps including a Peavey Envoy 110, a Sessionette 75 (transistor Vox-a-like), a Line6 Spider 5 set up like a Twin Reverb. I've tried it with and without the volume pedal. I've tried slimmer and lighter tone bars, but it always sounds the same.
So, my question is is it my technique: for example too much/little bar pressure? Is it my strings (GHS standard roundwound)? Is it my tone bar (a fairly weighty 3/4" nickel-steel thing)? Is it the Fender PSG itself and I'm expecting it to do things it will never do and it's just tough luck? Is it the amp (considering that other people get a nice bright sound out of a Twin)? Something else I haven't considered...
If you can help that'd be great cos it's really starting to put me off playing.
All the best, Nico
Re: Muddy tone from Fender Student PSG
Mon Jun 24, 2024 2:43 pm
A few things come to mind
1: Obviousley a broken pickup.
2: Old strings
3: Pickup height. Adjust as close as possible. Too close & the string will be damped. In the USA they say as a rough guide the thikness of a "Quarter" an the treble side (1.75mm) and two "Quarters" on the bass (3.5mm). From there reduce or increase till you get the sound your after.
4: Bad solder joints or bad connecter or any capacitive loading.
Fender Student should sound like https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jk2tTbUqmhk
atb
Pete
1: Obviousley a broken pickup.
2: Old strings
3: Pickup height. Adjust as close as possible. Too close & the string will be damped. In the USA they say as a rough guide the thikness of a "Quarter" an the treble side (1.75mm) and two "Quarters" on the bass (3.5mm). From there reduce or increase till you get the sound your after.
4: Bad solder joints or bad connecter or any capacitive loading.
Fender Student should sound like https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jk2tTbUqmhk
atb
Pete
Re: Muddy tone from Fender Student PSG
Mon Jun 24, 2024 5:31 pm
Hi Pete,
Thanks once again for the brilliant advice. That's 2 large drams I owe you now!
Turns out it was the pickup height. The PU is mounted directly onto the body, so there's no height adjustment. It was sitting about 4mm away from the strings, but I've made a makeshift shim out of neoprene and hey presto! What a difference!!!
I wonder if it originally had a foam spacer that rotted away and the previous owner just screwed it down hard against the body.
Next job is to treat myself to some new strings. I put the last set on in March, but I'm keen to try some compressed roundwound next. Then I can get to the pickup properly and make a bit less of a bodge-job of shimming it.
Once again, thank you Sir!
Thanks once again for the brilliant advice. That's 2 large drams I owe you now!
Turns out it was the pickup height. The PU is mounted directly onto the body, so there's no height adjustment. It was sitting about 4mm away from the strings, but I've made a makeshift shim out of neoprene and hey presto! What a difference!!!
I wonder if it originally had a foam spacer that rotted away and the previous owner just screwed it down hard against the body.
Next job is to treat myself to some new strings. I put the last set on in March, but I'm keen to try some compressed roundwound next. Then I can get to the pickup properly and make a bit less of a bodge-job of shimming it.
Once again, thank you Sir!